People Need The Touch, with Tom Kaiser

Gary Michels: 00:00:00

Welcome to Let's Talk Legacy. I'm Gary Michels,

Gary Michels: 00:00:03

your host, founder of Southwestern Legacy Insurance

Gary Michels: 00:00:05

Group, and today we have Tom Kaiser, the guest on the show.

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Tom Kaiser is the managing partner of Masterful Coaching, a

Gary Michels: 00:00:14

renowned expert in the field of collaboration. He also has a

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deep background in the insurance industry, both domestic and

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worldwide, with experience running large, complex, global

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businesses, including serving as a top executive in Arch Right

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Insurance, Zurich Financial Solutions, he either built the

Gary Michels: 00:00:32

business from the ground up, which is very interesting to me

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and our listeners, or transform them into a dynamic industry

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leader. Thank you for joining our show.

Tom Kaiser: 00:00:41

Glad to do it.

Gary Michels: 00:00:42

So you started off in the Air Force, but that

Gary Michels: 00:00:45

experience sort of unexpectedly opened up some doors for you

Gary Michels: 00:00:49

later in the insurance field. Talk about that a little bit.

Tom Kaiser: 00:00:53

It did as a matter of fact, I spent five years as a

Tom Kaiser: 00:00:55

KC 135 navigator in the US Air Force, and I thought that, gee,

Tom Kaiser: 00:01:00

I must have missed out on business for those five years,

Tom Kaiser: 00:01:03

so I probably should find a job. And that took me to our great

Tom Kaiser: 00:01:07

Mutual Insurance where the guy was running it was a B, 29

Tom Kaiser: 00:01:11

pilot, and the number two guy was an F, 106 pilot. We talked

Tom Kaiser: 00:01:15

to airplanes and they hired me. That's how I got in the

Tom Kaiser: 00:01:17

insurance business. They had served during World War Two, I

Tom Kaiser: 00:01:21

came into the Vietnam so they were already well established in

Tom Kaiser: 00:01:24

business, but their background was in aviation.

Gary Michels: 00:01:27

When you were growing up, what were your

Gary Michels: 00:01:29

aspirations?

Tom Kaiser: 00:01:30

It was wide open. I went to university. When I came

Tom Kaiser: 00:01:34

out of university, I happened to be one of the first people who

Tom Kaiser: 00:01:38

got a low lottery number in the crazy draft. And so six months

Tom Kaiser: 00:01:43

after graduating from college, I was in the Air Force. I decided

Tom Kaiser: 00:01:47

that if I could fly, that was what I was going to do. So I

Tom Kaiser: 00:01:50

passed the flight physicals, and that led me to the five years

Tom Kaiser: 00:01:54

that I spent in the Air Force. From that perspective, I knew I

Tom Kaiser: 00:01:58

wanted to go into business, but I really didn't know exactly

Tom Kaiser: 00:02:01

what what led me to insurance was, again, the feeling that I

Tom Kaiser: 00:02:06

had that five years of being an aviator somehow put me behind my

Tom Kaiser: 00:02:10

peers who had been in business for five years, and I had to

Tom Kaiser: 00:02:14

find a way to catch up. And that was not true, but I just

Tom Kaiser: 00:02:17

believed that, and so I looked for jobs that really were based

Tom Kaiser: 00:02:21

on merit, 100% on merit, and ended up in a sales position

Tom Kaiser: 00:02:25

where I was selling large property insurance packages for

Tom Kaiser: 00:02:29

factory mutual.

Gary Michels: 00:02:30

So when you first approached them about insurance,

Gary Michels: 00:02:34

were you fascinated with business more, or were you

Gary Michels: 00:02:37

fascinated more with insurance?

Tom Kaiser: 00:02:39

I was a know nothing on insurance at that point, I

Tom Kaiser: 00:02:43

was, I was fascinated by the fact that arc right at the time

Tom Kaiser: 00:02:46

or factory mutual tailored insurance products to specific

Tom Kaiser: 00:02:50

solutions or problems that companies had, and so it was a

Tom Kaiser: 00:02:54

very good for anybody who was selling those products.

Gary Michels: 00:02:58

Got it. One of the more interesting and unique

Gary Michels: 00:03:00

items we saw on your resume is from your time serving as the

Gary Michels: 00:03:05

executive VP and president of marine and energy for our

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insurance group where you were responsible for global marine

Gary Michels: 00:03:12

energy and aviation and terrorism, which really

Gary Michels: 00:03:15

intrigued me. Terrorism insurance, is that a thing?

Tom Kaiser: 00:03:19

After 9/11 the insurance industry backed out of

Tom Kaiser: 00:03:24

including terrorism insurance or any anything associated with

Tom Kaiser: 00:03:28

terrorism, and the government came out with definitions of

Tom Kaiser: 00:03:32

what terrorism is. And so an event like 9/11 is defined as

Tom Kaiser: 00:03:38

terrorism. It's not insured. So the insurance industry responded

Tom Kaiser: 00:03:42

with the government to come up with solutions to fill that

Tom Kaiser: 00:03:46

void, and a new product was developed because the other one

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was gone, and it supported, basically and complemented what

Tom Kaiser: 00:03:55

the government was offering in the well realm of terrorism

Tom Kaiser: 00:03:58

insurance, but it was basically a property insurance that would

Tom Kaiser: 00:04:02

pay if your property was destroyed by a declared

Tom Kaiser: 00:04:05

terrorist event.

Gary Michels: 00:04:06

Was there a big demand for that after 9/11? I

Gary Michels: 00:04:09

imagine there was.

Tom Kaiser: 00:04:11

In certain industries, yes. I mean, in the

Tom Kaiser: 00:04:13

aviation business, big demand depends on what the industry

Tom Kaiser: 00:04:17

was, because most people were not buying the product. But

Tom Kaiser: 00:04:21

those that really felt that they were in a situation where they

Tom Kaiser: 00:04:25

could have a terrorist attack and lose large assets, they were

Tom Kaiser: 00:04:29

attracted to it.

Gary Michels: 00:04:30

So you helped transform that company into a

Gary Michels: 00:04:34

billion dollar company.

Tom Kaiser: 00:04:36

Well, it was a new company, arch. Arch was born out

Tom Kaiser: 00:04:39

of 9/11, and several people raised the capital. And I was

Tom Kaiser: 00:04:44

fortunate enough that I was working with Ben and

Tom Kaiser: 00:04:47

dinosaurdano at Zurich, and he went over to become the CEO, and

Tom Kaiser: 00:04:52

he brought me over in the number two role. It went from a very

Tom Kaiser: 00:04:56

small company into a very large company, rapidly, very clear.

Tom Kaiser: 00:05:00

Success story today, arch is about a $35 billion company

Tom Kaiser: 00:05:04

really relied on individuals that had skin in the game and

Tom Kaiser: 00:05:09

were very entrepreneurial to build individual businesses

Tom Kaiser: 00:05:13

that, when you added them all up, became quite a significant

Tom Kaiser: 00:05:16

business under the name or the brand that was promoting it,

Tom Kaiser: 00:05:21

recruiting was the key, key to building arch, or building any

Tom Kaiser: 00:05:27

of the companies that I worked with, to find the right people

Tom Kaiser: 00:05:30

that are focused in the right way, they have the right

Tom Kaiser: 00:05:34

attitude, and they want to make it happen. And you can move the

Tom Kaiser: 00:05:37

world. Those who have a lot of self confidence. Want to win,

Tom Kaiser: 00:05:43

and they want others to win, and they're very keen on

Tom Kaiser: 00:05:46

relationship and relationship management. You had to build

Tom Kaiser: 00:05:49

relationships with brokers, you had to build relationships with

Tom Kaiser: 00:05:52

customers, and all this had to come together in a positive way.

Tom Kaiser: 00:05:57

As a manager, you become a coach when you want your employee or

Tom Kaiser: 00:06:01

your report to win, instead of just managing them, you pick up

Tom Kaiser: 00:06:05

on it, I think, very quickly, if they have the same desire,

Tom Kaiser: 00:06:09

because you're working closely with them, you're not some guy

Tom Kaiser: 00:06:12

in the back room. Look at how many calls somebody made,

Tom Kaiser: 00:06:15

whether they made their calls or not. You're out there talking

Tom Kaiser: 00:06:18

about the actual business and how it works.

Gary Michels: 00:06:22

Can you give some examples and talk about the

Gary Michels: 00:06:24

importance of that for a leader to actually be there by their

Gary Michels: 00:06:27

side, doing it with them?

Tom Kaiser: 00:06:30

Well, I think people need the touch. It's not

Tom Kaiser: 00:06:32

something that can be done in a vacuum. It's something there,

Tom Kaiser: 00:06:35

where you're there, you're part of the whole process. I can't

Tom Kaiser: 00:06:39

emphasize enough that you're driven because you want them to

Tom Kaiser: 00:06:42

win, to be successful, and that's where you're coming from.

Tom Kaiser: 00:06:46

People pick up on that. And when you do that enough and you have

Tom Kaiser: 00:06:50

enough people involved, and it becomes a cultural thing, people

Tom Kaiser: 00:06:54

just get it, and they want to be part of it, and they help you

Tom Kaiser: 00:06:58

ferret out those that don't belong is a remarkable thing,

Tom Kaiser: 00:07:03

because once you have that alignment, and that alignment

Tom Kaiser: 00:07:07

working for you, it's a self correcting environment that they

Tom Kaiser: 00:07:12

don't want to let anybody in that doesn't buy into what we're

Tom Kaiser: 00:07:15

doing here and why we're doing it.

Gary Michels: 00:07:17

I think that is such a huge point you're

Gary Michels: 00:07:20

bringing up. How does that stay going when they have their first

Gary Michels: 00:07:23

hiccups?

Tom Kaiser: 00:07:24

Well, I think, I think if you've established your

Tom Kaiser: 00:07:28

relationship with that employee as a coach, you're going to have

Tom Kaiser: 00:07:32

that opportunity to coach them, and in that process, the walls

Tom Kaiser: 00:07:36

are going to be a lot easier to climb, the the obstacles are

Tom Kaiser: 00:07:41

going to be things you can talk about, and there's other people

Tom Kaiser: 00:07:44

within your team that you can bring in, if you're a good

Tom Kaiser: 00:07:47

coach, to say, well, here's how Joe dealt with that. You need to

Tom Kaiser: 00:07:51

talk to him right. Recognizing we're all going to have

Tom Kaiser: 00:07:54

challenges, but by talking about them and working with them, we

Tom Kaiser: 00:07:59

can make ourselves better and more successful.

Gary Michels: 00:08:02

What are some key things besides, you said that

Gary Michels: 00:08:05

we're looking for people that want to win. They want other

Gary Michels: 00:08:08

people to win. Anything else that you think is important when

Gary Michels: 00:08:11

you're looking for an employee, a person that you're going to

Gary Michels: 00:08:14

build a business with?

Tom Kaiser: 00:08:15

I always look for high energy people. And I think,

Tom Kaiser: 00:08:18

I think the I like people who took care of themselves, that

Tom Kaiser: 00:08:23

were physically fit, that had other things going in their

Tom Kaiser: 00:08:27

life, and, you know, had a very broad background of how things

Tom Kaiser: 00:08:34

worked and what they believed in. Because I think, you know,

Tom Kaiser: 00:08:38

as the whole person that always served me well too. I like

Tom Kaiser: 00:08:42

people who tried to close me, who wanted the job and asked for

Tom Kaiser: 00:08:45

it. I gotta tell you a story. It's funny. When we first

Tom Kaiser: 00:08:48

started arch, I spent 90% of my time recruiting people. People

Tom Kaiser: 00:08:53

were very reluctant to leave a big company safe position and

Tom Kaiser: 00:08:58

come with a startup. A year later, we had to fight these

Tom Kaiser: 00:09:01

people off, because once it showed it was successful and it

Tom Kaiser: 00:09:05

was a moving thing that was really doing well, they all

Tom Kaiser: 00:09:08

wanted to join your success is also what drives bringing in

Tom Kaiser: 00:09:13

good people. If you got a great company and they see you as a

Tom Kaiser: 00:09:18

great leader, they're going to want to work for you. So you

Tom Kaiser: 00:09:21

have to use that to your advantage also.

Gary Michels: 00:09:24

What does a good agent do to get them to go, I

Gary Michels: 00:09:27

think I'm gonna go with these guys?

Tom Kaiser: 00:09:30

The fact about insurance is its the thing that

Tom Kaiser: 00:09:32

everybody needs, but they don't necessarily want it, right? So

Tom Kaiser: 00:09:37

the need is created by the fact that if you have a home or a car

Tom Kaiser: 00:09:42

or you have a business, no matter what you have, there's

Tom Kaiser: 00:09:46

going to be certain requirements of things that you have to buy

Tom Kaiser: 00:09:49

to protect that business, or to protect the home or the auto or

Tom Kaiser: 00:09:53

what have you, life insurance is another question is more

Tom Kaiser: 00:09:56

complicated, because there's more reasons why. They people

Tom Kaiser: 00:10:00

buy or don't buy, then the simple thing that the government

Tom Kaiser: 00:10:03

says, You have to have auto insurance. But I think, I think

Tom Kaiser: 00:10:06

the struggle is that people really don't know who they want

Tom Kaiser: 00:10:11

to buy from. And there's lots of places you can go to to buy your

Tom Kaiser: 00:10:14

insurance, and there's lots of different products that are

Tom Kaiser: 00:10:17

offered and the general marketplace, I always found that

Tom Kaiser: 00:10:21

the best thing to work for me was to open up and help somewhat

Tom Kaiser: 00:10:29

with the entire package, from A to Z. What are you trying to do

Tom Kaiser: 00:10:33

with your financial planning? What are you trying to do with

Tom Kaiser: 00:10:37

all of the insurance products? How do you look at it. I used to

Tom Kaiser: 00:10:41

start a conversation with people saying that you do not build an

Tom Kaiser: 00:10:45

insurance program from the bottom up. You build it from the

Tom Kaiser: 00:10:48

top down. And what people make, the biggest mistake they make,

Tom Kaiser: 00:10:51

is they start from the bottom up, and they self insure the

Tom Kaiser: 00:10:53

biggest exposures they have, which is the top end of it,

Tom Kaiser: 00:10:57

where, if the worst thing happened, you're in bad shape.

Tom Kaiser: 00:11:00

That was a good way to start a conversation with people didn't

Tom Kaiser: 00:11:03

know a lot about insurance.

Gary Michels: 00:11:05

What would you say, you've been in this space

Gary Michels: 00:11:07

for so long? There was a legacy you were to leave. Of Gosh, Tom

Gary Michels: 00:11:12

absolutely believed insurance was a necessary thing people

Gary Michels: 00:11:15

need in their lives, and this is why. What would you want people

Gary Michels: 00:11:19

to leave with?

Tom Kaiser: 00:11:20

Well, I think I think my legacy is out there.

Tom Kaiser: 00:11:22

There's probably 30 guys that work for me that are running

Tom Kaiser: 00:11:26

significant portions of insurance companies, that have

Tom Kaiser: 00:11:29

big jobs in those companies, and they're all part of the team

Tom Kaiser: 00:11:33

that I assembled at these various companies. I'm really

Tom Kaiser: 00:11:36

proud of these guys, and they really have been successful and

Tom Kaiser: 00:11:40

have been the new leaders as I've drifted out of the

Tom Kaiser: 00:11:44

business, but my legacy is really those people who are out

Tom Kaiser: 00:11:46

there that are still working, that I influenced, that I

Tom Kaiser: 00:11:50

brought into the business, and now have significant roles

Tom Kaiser: 00:11:53

within various companies.

Gary Michels: 00:11:55

Deep in your core, because obviously that meant a

Gary Michels: 00:11:58

lot to you to do that, and you're so proud of that. What

Gary Michels: 00:12:01

does legacy mean to you?

Tom Kaiser: 00:12:03

Well, I think it's something lasting that is beyond

Tom Kaiser: 00:12:06

you and the contribution you were making at the time. So so

Tom Kaiser: 00:12:10

the way I define it is I left the business physically in oh

Tom Kaiser: 00:12:15

eight, and haven't worked for an insurance company since oh

Tom Kaiser: 00:12:18

eight, but I've got a whole cadre of people who are in

Tom Kaiser: 00:12:22

senior positions that I hired and I trained that continue to

Tom Kaiser: 00:12:27

support a lot of the things that we've been talking about. You'll

Tom Kaiser: 00:12:30

hear them talk about alignment and the importance of making

Tom Kaiser: 00:12:33

sure everybody's pulling in the same direction. I used to say

Tom Kaiser: 00:12:37

that, you know, if you got four powerful horses and you hook

Tom Kaiser: 00:12:41

them to a wagon, and you decide to pull the wagon in different

Tom Kaiser: 00:12:44

directions. You pull the wagon apart, but if you get them going

Tom Kaiser: 00:12:46

into a straight line, you can go anywhere. A lot of this isn't

Tom Kaiser: 00:12:50

rocket science, just stuff that you got to repeat over and over

Tom Kaiser: 00:12:53

and over again and tell stories about and celebrate successes

Tom Kaiser: 00:12:58

around, because that alignment is so important.

Gary Michels: 00:13:01

Absolutely. Why should someone buy insurance?

Tom Kaiser: 00:13:06

For protection and risk management. In other words,

Tom Kaiser: 00:13:08

you're trying, you're transferring risk at a price,

Tom Kaiser: 00:13:11

and that's to be part of your risk management orientation,

Tom Kaiser: 00:13:15

that you don't have to bear that risk. If the worst case scenario

Tom Kaiser: 00:13:18

happened, your house burns down, your there's an explosion, you

Tom Kaiser: 00:13:23

die, you name it. So it's all. Everybody should have an

Tom Kaiser: 00:13:28

orientation towards risk management. Insurance is one of

Tom Kaiser: 00:13:31

the tools that goes with risk management.

Gary Michels: 00:13:34

Right on. And lastly, if someone did want to

Gary Michels: 00:13:37

collaborate with you to learn more about Collab Lab, your

Gary Michels: 00:13:42

company, a little bit more about what you do. How would they get

Gary Michels: 00:13:46

in touch with you?

Tom Kaiser: 00:13:47

But they should go on to masterfulcoaching.com. And

Tom Kaiser: 00:13:50

I'll make an offer to the we have a book called a revenue

Tom Kaiser: 00:13:54

engine, an e book, and they can go in there and download that

Tom Kaiser: 00:13:57

for free. Masterfulcoaching.com.

Gary Michels: 00:14:01

Awesome. You've been listening to Tom Kaiser.

Gary Michels: 00:14:03

Just appreciate your time today.

Tom Kaiser: 00:14:05

Super.