Episode 50

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Published on:

7th Aug 2024

What Really Matters, with Hal Donaldson

Hal Donaldson, president and CEO of Convoy of Hope, talks about meeting Mother Teresa, living on the streets for research, receiving a perspective-changing health scare, the importance of life insurance to his employees, the simple value of just doing the next kind thing, and creating a different kind of bucket list, and why no one has a monopoly on compassion.

Transcript
Gary Michels:

Welcome to Let's Talk Legacy. My name is Gary

Gary Michels:

Michels. And today we have an amazing guest Hal Donaldson, the

Gary Michels:

president and CEO of Convoy of Hope, a global nonprofit

Gary Michels:

organization that works with communities to address root

Gary Michels:

causes of poverty and hunger. And that always has been a

Gary Michels:

challenge that our world sees, according to Forbes Convoy of

Gary Michels:

Hope is among the 50 largest charities in the United States.

Gary Michels:

So I'm just excited to speak with Hal. And I know our

Gary Michels:

listeners are excited to hear from you today to welcome.

Hal Donaldson:

Thank you for having me, Gary, great to be

Hal Donaldson:

with you in the podcast.

Gary Michels:

Let's dig right in, I want to start by talking

Gary Michels:

about family, your family in the legacy of your family had a huge

Gary Michels:

impact on you, and the way that you are now helping shape the

Gary Michels:

legacies of so many others, the story of your grandfather, and

Gary Michels:

the impact of his actions on your family is a powerful one.

Gary Michels:

How did that family history influence your own beliefs about

Gary Michels:

success, failure, redemption, and other thoughts that come

Gary Michels:

across your mind?

Hal Donaldson:

Yeah, you know, really, we have to go back

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before my grandfather and talk about what happened to me when I

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was 12. And when I was 12, you know, my parents were hit by a

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drunk driver, and my father was killed in slim, a mother was

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seriously injured, she'd be in the hospital for quite some time

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unable to work, our family didn't have insurance, Gary. And

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so as a result, our family was forced to survive on welfare and

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food stamps. So as a young boy, you know, I really experienced

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the pain of poverty, and the pain of suffering and the shame

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of all of it. And it was really the kindness of people who

Hal Donaldson:

really reached out to me, you know, they, they just wrap their

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arms around me and put new shoes on my feet when they saw that I

Hal Donaldson:

have holes in my sneakers, brought groceries to our door.

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So it was really the kindness of those people that I think really

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affected me the most long term. My grandfather was extremely

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successful in his line of work, but he had like a fool of

Hal Donaldson:

himself, and ended up losing his entire family along the way.

Hal Donaldson:

Certainly, for me, that was something along the way that I

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did not want to replicate. I think the biggest impact on my

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life was really just living in poverty, trying to escape

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poverty. That really was the journey I was on as a teenager,

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I wasn't going to live like this, like my parents had lived.

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So you know, I think that really, that played a big part

Hal Donaldson:

in the formation of Convoy of Hope.

Gary Michels:

Your grandmother's advice seems to have been the

Gary Michels:

guiding light in your life, though, can you share how her

Gary Michels:

words influenced you?

Hal Donaldson:

Oh, she had observed my grandfather really

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just getting full of himself and making some poor choices. And

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her advice to me was, as you enter into the workforce, you

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just need to work hard, be a good person, treat people with

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integrity to the right thing. And everything is going to take

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care of itself. You don't need to go and you know, become a

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climber. And where you are harming people along your

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journey. You just need to be a good person, and everything will

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take care of itself. And you know, that advice really was

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extremely instrumental. You know, my story, Gary is I became

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a writer in my 20s. I have a journalism degree, I began

Hal Donaldson:

writing books in my 20s, one of those projects took me to

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Kolkata, India, and where I interviewed Mother Teresa. So in

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the course of interviewing Mother Teresa, that she just

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stops me and she just said, Hey, young man, what are you doing to

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help the poor in the suffering? And I figured it was probably

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not a good idea to lie to Mother Teresa. So I told her the truth.

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I said, Hey, I'm really not doing much of anything. And she

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said, everyone can do something. Just do the next kind thing that

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God puts in front of you. And those words were haunting, but

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they dovetailed so well, with what my grandmother had said,

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you know, just do the right thing. Just do the kind of thing

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and everything is going to take care of itself. I came back

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after meeting Mother Teresa. I did what I call reconnaissance.

Hal Donaldson:

I traveled to eight cities. I lived in the streets for three

Hal Donaldson:

days and three nights. went to Miami, Atlanta, Chicago, dc in

Hal Donaldson:

New York, major cities. And I just walked the streets with a

Hal Donaldson:

hidden tape recorder, interviewing drug addicts and

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gang members, prostitutes, runaways and the homeless and

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riding with the police on the midnight shift in each of those

Hal Donaldson:

cities. That's really what changed the course of my life. I

Hal Donaldson:

saw pain and suffering on a scale I'd never seen before and

Hal Donaldson:

came back and loaded up a pickup truck with $300 Really groceries

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30 years ago now. And that was the beginning of convoy.

Gary Michels:

Wow. It's one thing to know about it. But

Gary Michels:

you're right. It's another thing to experience it.

Hal Donaldson:

Yes.

Gary Michels:

My father was a police officer and I said I want

Gary Michels:

to do the ride alongs because I want to see what you experience

Gary Michels:

okay with these people that human beings that at some point

Gary Michels:

were living normal lives and something affected them as very

Gary Michels:

good. You know, I had an opportunity Go to San Quentin

Gary Michels:

Prison. My father would take a group of his students for years,

Gary Michels:

he taught teachers how to work with delinquent youths, we would

Gary Michels:

got to go into San Quentin Prison. We went in there, and

Gary Michels:

they have a program that they work with students that maybe

Gary Michels:

are on borderline of getting into the streets and having

Gary Michels:

problems. And so you don't want to get there. And these

Gary Michels:

prisoners were like coaches, and they talked to us about how to

Gary Michels:

be and work with them. And it touched my heart because most of

Gary Michels:

them said that they come from poor families that come from

Gary Michels:

rich families. They come from all over the the universe here,

Gary Michels:

but most of them their their switch was when they were early

Gary Michels:

teenagers.

Hal Donaldson:

Yeah. Oh, yeah.

Gary Michels:

How have you grown this thing so big? Because I can

Gary Michels:

tell just talking to you have the biggest heart, but not

Gary Michels:

everybody's like that. Not everybody's kind, how have you

Gary Michels:

been able to build this thing?

Hal Donaldson:

Yeah, you know, I people ask me that. They say,

Hal Donaldson:

what's the secret sauce? How is it gone from the back of a

Hal Donaldson:

pickup truck to being? I think we're actually number 35 on

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Forbes list. You know, I can honestly tell you that. I

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believe vision is incremental. You know, it's just doing the

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right thing, doing the opportunistic thing,

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opportunities, come your way doing it and doing it well. And

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just building upon that, I don't know that 30 years ago, that we

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had this massive strategic plan that it was going to be, you

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know, something this large, it really was just responding to

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needs, you know, I'm a person of faith. And so I believe that God

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puts needs in front of you, and you, it gives you opportunities

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to respond to those needs. And the same for your your

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listeners, you know, as they go through their daily life when

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they encounter someone who's hurting someone who's lonely,

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it's as simple as that. And I really think that's been the

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story of conduit of hope we've just responded to needs for 30

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years and tried to do it in a way that helps people maintain

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their dignity. You know, we feed nearly 600,000 children every

Hal Donaldson:

day, around the world, about 50,000 women and girls go

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through our jobs training, our teaching every year, we have 25

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30,000 farmers that go through training so that they can

Hal Donaldson:

increase their yields. It wasn't a big plan. It was just like,

Hal Donaldson:

hey, here's an opportunity. Let's step into it. Let's do the

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best job, we can see where it takes us. And I know that's

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probably not a good business model. But it's certainly how

Hal Donaldson:

we've, we've grown.

Gary Michels:

And you're doing something right now as president

Gary Michels:

and CEO of Convoy of Hope that's a big thing. Sometimes the

Gary Michels:

challenges that you faced aren't talked about, yeah, and

Gary Michels:

sacrifices you've personally put into this, talk to me a little

Gary Michels:

bit about some of the struggles you've had of getting this thing

Gary Michels:

up and running, not just for your company, okay for your

Gary Michels:

organization. But personally.

Hal Donaldson:

You know, well, as you know, Gary have a book

Hal Donaldson:

and it's entitled, what really matters, how to care for

Hal Donaldson:

yourself and serve a hurting world. And my hope is that

Hal Donaldson:

people will learn from my mistakes. Because in the early

Hal Donaldson:

days, I was so passionate about helping people escape poverty,

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again, because of my upbringing. And when I saw poverty in the

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lives of other people, I just, you know, I want to do

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everything I can. And I found myself really traveling all over

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the world all over the United States, spending 150 Nights 200

Hal Donaldson:

nights away from home, I had four small daughters. And so you

Hal Donaldson:

know, I think I was I had reckless ambition, much like my

Hal Donaldson:

grandfather, I was abusing my family, because I wasn't there.

Hal Donaldson:

And when I was there, sure. I mean, I took good care of them.

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I told my kids bedtime stories, I tuck them in. I did everything

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that a loving father should do. But there's something to be said

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about time and a time away. You know, it hit me probably about

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the age of 50. It really hit me that I had paid too great a

Hal Donaldson:

price. I was making sacrifices. I didn't need to make those

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sacrifices were time they were finances. They were health. And

Hal Donaldson:

you tell yourself, you know what, I can sacrifice sleep, I

Hal Donaldson:

can sacrifice nutrition, I can sacrifice, et cetera, et cetera,

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because I'm doing such a good work around the world. But what

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I discovered is that when you take care of yourself, that's

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not a selfish deed. That's actually a selfless thing.

Hal Donaldson:

Because it enables you to help more people and not to operate

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from this constant deficit.

Gary Michels:

That's huge. What was it? Was there a health scare

Gary Michels:

was there...

Hal Donaldson:

Yeah, I was sitting at my desk and I had a

Hal Donaldson:

sharp pain in my back. And I thought, Okay, well, this feels

Hal Donaldson:

like it might be a kidney stone. And so I left work drove home,

Hal Donaldson:

it didn't get any better. I told my wife I said, Hey, I think you

Hal Donaldson:

need to take me to emergency they need to give me something

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to pass the stone On. And here I am with a blood pressure cuff on

Hal Donaldson:

on my arm. And all of a sudden the nurse said, this isn't a

Hal Donaldson:

kidney stone, I think you, you're on the verge of a heart

Hal Donaldson:

attack. And I just couldn't believe it. Next thing I know

Hal Donaldson:

I'm being strapped to a gurney and rushed into surgery. And

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they put two stents in my heart. That was a wake up call. I

Hal Donaldson:

literally came out of that surgery. And at the time, I was

Hal Donaldson:

writing books. I was traveling and speaking a lot. I was

Hal Donaldson:

working as the editor in chief of an international magazine, I

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was trying to do it all. I was on like eight boards, board of

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directors of different organizations around the

Hal Donaldson:

country, major organizations, I stepped off every one of them.

Hal Donaldson:

And I put two of my jobs. And I gave my life and my focus to

Hal Donaldson:

Conway hope that proved to be a very good decision.

Gary Michels:

Wow. So through your programs over the years,

Gary Michels:

convoy has distributed more than $2.5 billion worth of food and

Gary Michels:

supplies helped more than 250 million people and currently

Gary Michels:

feeds more than 570,000 children. And I wanted to make

Gary Michels:

sure I was correct on that. It's grown. What is the Conway

Gary Michels:

mission today? And is it changed at all over the years? Is it is

Gary Michels:

it more encompassing than just making sure they're fed?

Hal Donaldson:

Yes, especially I would say like in the US, like

Hal Donaldson:

we do these citywide festivals where we actually go in and

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provide free medical and dental care, job fairs. We help people

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prepare a resume, we provide them with groceries, we have

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things for kids, we have new shoes and give them clothes and

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the list goes on. It's a full menu of services. Here's what

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we've discovered in the United States is that no one has a

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monopoly on compassion, that if you come in and you're neutral,

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you can bring you can bring churches, civic groups,

Hal Donaldson:

government and businesses altogether, to touch their city.

Hal Donaldson:

Often they're working apart. And we've found that it's amazing to

Hal Donaldson:

see them work together to make their communities a better place

Hal Donaldson:

to live. Internationally. One of the things we found we started

Hal Donaldson:

with a feeding program with children, but we found that the

Hal Donaldson:

mothers of these children would come to bring their kids and

Hal Donaldson:

they were just hanging around all day, while these kids were

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in school. We feed the kids in school because that keeps them

Hal Donaldson:

in school, you don't feed them in school, parents have them out

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on street corners, begging or scavenging our garbage heaps,

Hal Donaldson:

you know, convoy, typically what we'll do is provide one meal a

Hal Donaldson:

day, at school at lunch. And then for the weekends, they'll

Hal Donaldson:

take home rations for their family. But what we found was

Hal Donaldson:

the mothers were hanging around. And so we said, well, what if we

Hal Donaldson:

started a job training program, or the mothers so that we don't

Hal Donaldson:

have to feed their kids, they're feeding their own kids, and

Hal Donaldson:

every year 50,000 women go through the program.

Gary Michels:

That is awesome. Do you have a success story that

Gary Michels:

really touches your heart about a community. I'm sure there's

Gary Michels:

many, but is there a one at the top of your head that touches

Gary Michels:

your heart?

Hal Donaldson:

Yeah, I think, you know, our goal is not to go

Hal Donaldson:

to a community and stay. Our goal is to go to a community and

Hal Donaldson:

make sure that community is healthy, and then leave to go to

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another community. And so one example would be in Nepal

Hal Donaldson:

following earthquake some years ago, convoy hook came in. And we

Hal Donaldson:

began working with the farmers to really expand their yield and

Hal Donaldson:

to show them what other crops they could be growing, that

Hal Donaldson:

would be financially lucrative for them. And over a course of a

Hal Donaldson:

couple of years, we were able to bring that community back to

Hal Donaldson:

health, we had a feeding program the kids, but they began feeding

Hal Donaldson:

themselves and began feeding their own kids. And so we moved

Hal Donaldson:

10 miles down the road to another village and to another

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community. And then after that one became healthy, we went to

Hal Donaldson:

another community. And so I think that's one example, here

Hal Donaldson:

in the States. I think one of the things that we've done that,

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and I say we I think collect, I say that collectively, I think

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we've been able to activate churches, you know, churches

Hal Donaldson:

typically have a heart for what we're doing. The Bible commands

Hal Donaldson:

them to help the poor, but they don't necessarily have a track

Hal Donaldson:

to run on. And so one of the things I think we've been able

Hal Donaldson:

to do is not only introduce them to businesses, and civic groups

Hal Donaldson:

in their own community, but so that they can work together, but

Hal Donaldson:

also to activate them to show them what they can do. And I

Hal Donaldson:

believe that the church in America is almost like a

Hal Donaldson:

sleeping giant. I mean, there are millions of people who

Hal Donaldson:

attend churches of different faiths, who have a heart for

Hal Donaldson:

this, but they don't necessarily know what to do. And so across

Hal Donaldson:

America, I think we've been able to activate churches.

Gary Michels:

Yeah. Now, you mentioned at the beginning that

Gary Michels:

your parents didn't have life insurance didn't have insurance.

Gary Michels:

And this show is by no means even though we're a life

Gary Michels:

insurance car. But he is it really pushing life insurance?

Gary Michels:

I've seen being in the business now how having this protection

Gary Michels:

has helped so many families and not burden the kids and not

Gary Michels:

burden the spouse when something happens, but what's been your

Gary Michels:

experience with life insurance? And what you've seen over the

Gary Michels:

years, with your employees? And even the people that you serve?

Hal Donaldson:

Yeah, well, first of all the employees, we really

Hal Donaldson:

emphasize the importance of it, you know, we've lost some really

Hal Donaldson:

dear people, my lost during COVID, I lost six close friends

Hal Donaldson:

in a period of 14 months. And they were all healthy. You know.

Hal Donaldson:

And so it's very difficult to deal with that if you don't have

Hal Donaldson:

adequate life insurance. So I know you didn't ask for a plug.

Hal Donaldson:

But I am a strong believer. So I would say, internationally. And

Hal Donaldson:

even in the US, I have a deep concern that there are many

Hal Donaldson:

families that are our month to month, and they don't have

Hal Donaldson:

insurance of any kind. And it's as someone that had gone through

Hal Donaldson:

that in my teens, it's brutal. When you are not insured, it is

Hal Donaldson:

brutal. And so I couldn't say more that from a convoy

Hal Donaldson:

standpoint, our job is to keep people healthy. And once they

Hal Donaldson:

get healthy and get a job, then insurance certainly is an

Hal Donaldson:

important part of it. I'm a strong believer.

Gary Michels:

I get to see firsthand, being in the

Gary Michels:

business.

Hal Donaldson:

I'm a strong believer.

Gary Michels:

Yeah, so a lot of guests we've had on the program

Gary Michels:

come from families of backgrounds, of great legacy,

Gary Michels:

and great achievements, that find it sometimes challenging to

Gary Michels:

forge their own. What advice would you give to someone

Gary Michels:

struggling to identify kind of what their force is what their

Gary Michels:

dream is? I mean, what could you share that would give people

Gary Michels:

some optimism, of even if you're not there yet, of knowing what

Gary Michels:

you want to do in your life, what would you give people as

Gary Michels:

advice there?

Hal Donaldson:

Well, the first would be, don't be afraid to do

Hal Donaldson:

reconnaissance. You know, when I went to the eight cities, I

Hal Donaldson:

mean, that was recon, you can do reconnaissance in your

Hal Donaldson:

community, or other communities or someplace around the world,

Hal Donaldson:

you may go there and not know what you're going to see or what

Hal Donaldson:

you're gonna do. It may be right for you, it may not be right for

Hal Donaldson:

you. But all of us, all of us need to have something that goes

Hal Donaldson:

beyond our everyday work, we need something that we're also

Hal Donaldson:

investing in people were investing in. And a good way to

Hal Donaldson:

find that out is recon. The second thing is to create a

Hal Donaldson:

different kind of bucket list. My bucket list for years was I

Hal Donaldson:

want to go to Antarctica, I want to go to Wimbledon. I want to

Hal Donaldson:

walk the red carpet, you know those kinds of things. And but I

Hal Donaldson:

think in time, I began to realize that I needed a

Hal Donaldson:

different kind of bucket list. Those things were good, well and

Hal Donaldson:

good. And they're still on the bucket list. But then there's

Hal Donaldson:

another question is, what do I What kind of imprint do I want

Hal Donaldson:

to leave on the world? What good do I want to do for the world to

Hal Donaldson:

make it a better place? And to add that to your bucket list.

Hal Donaldson:

And I did that some years ago. And and that was in itself. The

Hal Donaldson:

whole exercise was really, I think instrumental and doing

Hal Donaldson:

what I'm doing now.

Gary Michels:

So what does the word legacy mean to you?

Hal Donaldson:

Again, I'm a person of faith. And so the

Hal Donaldson:

first word that comes to mind is obedience. And I believe God

Hal Donaldson:

puts ideas and opportunities in front of us. And so that would

Hal Donaldson:

be one. But secondly, is I want my children and grandchildren to

Hal Donaldson:

know that I was genuine, that I really did care about people.

Hal Donaldson:

And then I was the same person at home. As I was on stage. I

Hal Donaldson:

was the same person at home as I was in the refugee camps. I want

Hal Donaldson:

them to know that they didn't have three dads, they had one,

Hal Donaldson:

if I can leave with them that kind of imprint that he was

Hal Donaldson:

generous. He was kind, but he was always the same. And he

Hal Donaldson:

treated everybody the same way, then I've done something.

Gary Michels:

That's huge with your own family. What what type

Gary Michels:

of legacy would you like to leave with Conway of hope?

Hal Donaldson:

I've thought about that a lot. It certainly

Hal Donaldson:

in my age. I've thought about that a lot. And I want them to

Hal Donaldson:

know that, that we are stewards of this organization. We're not

Hal Donaldson:

owners, I believe that belongs to God. And there's things that

Hal Donaldson:

God wants to do for millions of people around the world. And so

Hal Donaldson:

we have a responsibility to operate at the highest level of

Hal Donaldson:

integrity to do what we say we're going to do. That's the

Hal Donaldson:

legacy. I want to leave with them.

Gary Michels:

So what's next?

Hal Donaldson:

Yeah, I think Conroy has some goals. And so

Hal Donaldson:

certainly want to see those achieved. We want to be feeding

Hal Donaldson:

a million children a day, and we want to be training 250,000

Hal Donaldson:

women and girls every year and 100,000 farmers. So those are

Hal Donaldson:

some goals that are out there. But in the United States, we

Hal Donaldson:

want to establish regional distribution centers. We have to

Hal Donaldson:

now but we want to become more regionalized because that will

Hal Donaldson:

allow us to help more people in those communities and help us

Hal Donaldson:

respond to disasters whenever there's a major disaster convoys

Hal Donaldson:

responding and so by having regional distribution centers

Hal Donaldson:

that were allow us to do more. And, and then on a personal

Hal Donaldson:

level, my first grandchild is being born. So having four

Hal Donaldson:

daughters, I guess we're grandchildren will come along.

Hal Donaldson:

And so I just want to spend more time with my kids and my

Hal Donaldson:

grandkids.

Gary Michels:

Awesome. So if someone wants to get involved,

Gary Michels:

or get a copy of your book or in some way just be attached to

Gary Michels:

what you're doing, how would they reach you?

Hal Donaldson:

Well the book is available. Amazon, Barnes and

Hal Donaldson:

Noble a lot of different ways. But convoy of oak.org they just

Hal Donaldson:

go to the website, they can get a hold of me or they can find

Hal Donaldson:

out volunteer opportunities or trips that we're taking around

Hal Donaldson:

the world. We encourage people to go to convoy of hope.org.

Gary Michels:

Awesome, you know, you touched my heart.

Hal Donaldson:

Thank you for having me. I really, really

Hal Donaldson:

appreciate it.

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About the Podcast

Let's Talk Legacy
Presented by Southwestern Legacy Insurance Group
What does it mean to build and maintain a legacy, either in business, or for your loved ones? What tools and resources are available to help? Join the discussion as host Gary Michels, along with exciting guests and real listeners just like you, tackle the answers to these questions, and learn how to grow today, for a better tomorrow.



Southwestern/Great American, Inc., dba Southwestern Family of Companies, for itself and its related entities and their assigns, reserves and retains all rights to their copyrighted materials and trademarks contained in this podcast.
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